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WTF is AVC? – 12K 3D Printers Are Irrelevant – Resin
WTF is AVC? – 12K 3D Printers Are Irrelevant – Resin Printer Video for Beginners Comparing K Metrics
#WTF #AVC #12K #Printers #Irrelevant #Resin
“FauxHammer”
This video is a bit more long-form than usual, If you are a regular viewer, maybe skip to about 00:07:00 – (though I hope you will watch it all anyway to help boost the video and allow it to reach and help more people) But many of you have seen me make this same point over and over in all of my…
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This video is a bit more long-form than usual, If you are a regular viewer, maybe skip to about 00:07:00 – (though I hope you will watch it all anyway to help boost the video and allow it to reach and help more people) But many of you have seen me make this same point over and over in all of my printer review videos. And I've promised for a while that I'd stop repeating myself and make this separate video for the beginners. And now, in future videos I don't need to talk about 2k, 4k, 8k, 9k, 12k, 14k etc being misleading marketing terms anymore YAY! – I can just refer people here, which allows me to spend more time in reviews focusing on a printers features and the results it delivers.
TLDW, please stop comparing printers by their K metric, that measures the screen resolution, not the print quality – we nee something new, please can we call use AVC instead.
I'm always amazed in how much work you put into your videos. Excellent presentation.
Beautifully explained. Very useful for me as a newcomer to the 3D printing industry. And love the proposal of using AVC
How on earth am I 11 minutes into this video and you have not said ANYTHING. For the love of god, you could have just explained that resolution doesn't mean anything without considering the dimensions. aka DPI. Dots per square inch, or "VPI" voxels per square inch.
I just clicked the video as I am just starting resin. I have a FDM, and won a resin printer. I don't think mine has a "K" sticker on it. Everything you stated is however very very true as the "K" metrics don't apply when as a user I can set the layer height. I went ahead and subbed as I can see the learning potential of your channel. Thank you.
5 minutes in and just fluff and bad editing.
If FDM filament is measured by diameter, I don't see why resin printers shouldn't be measured in voxels; I'm with you on this one
If you want to really bum some viewers out, should we tell them that the real driving force of a quality print is the light source variation and that only 4% is actually transmitted to the resin vat? I can confidently say that 98% of resin printer users have no real idea of what the screen actually does in the printer, which goes doubly for the marketing department. Not surprisingly, most marketers have little to no technical chops when they market their products, as they're really selling you a used car. This one is better than that one, even though they were built in the same factory, with the same parts. Anyway, going off on a tangent here. Use two identical LCD screens, swap the light source, and you will definitely see a difference. 😉
now lets make this happen!
briefly about the video: look not at the resolution, but at the XY density. the same screen resolution in different sizes have different pixel density per inch – this is what affects the print quality.
You could have gotten to the point sooner, but it’d say you have been very clear. The metric they should use is pixel size or pixel density, not an absolute number with no reference. It’s a pretty straightforward concept, I think
So whsts the best printer
Thank you for the time and effort you have dedicated to this. I appreciate the information provided, especially as I am new to this process.
I agree that a base measure of AVC is a good place to start, but how does that corespond to actual output? There is a fair gap between the screen and the resin ( probably more than the AVC size ) Fep film is what 50 microns or more? , and the light is scattererd by the the film so the final blob of light that cures the resin will be different to AVC and as different printers have different ways of collimating the light it would be nice to be able to recognise manufacturers that work on improving this rather than possibly meaningless ( at the 25 micron and below range) AVC figure? The Saturn in your tests seemd to print better that others at the same resolution for example.
Would a smallest resolvable resin feature type standard make sense? Such as the pillars and holes on the test piece you use for tuning in exposure times.
I clicked this because I was looking for the AVC part. Kind of annoyed I had to jump back and forth looking for it
I propose a mstric that os: how many voxels fit in a 1cm cube
Bought an Elegoo mars 4 ultra for it's 18x18um pixel size. Need the most detail possible for some small functional parts. Screen resolution only makes sense comparing the same sized screen for sure.
the fact that the industry gets away with "total pixels" rather than "pixels per inch" is ridiculous.
Build volume is specified in three dimensions, not in liters. I see no reason not to do the same for voxel dimensions. Trying to reduce it to a single number will always lose important information, particularly about voxel anisotropy.
It seems FDM are trying to use a bigger nozzle hole, quicker but poorer quality, 3D printing: 0.4 to 0.6 and bigger
Next step: how much of the resolution survives the non parallel(or slightly diffused) light rays bleeding into each other? At least for x & y axis. That might be another differentiator. Lightsource, masking element and optical path from there into the resin would have influence.
Thank you for your video. I am new to the hobby and am currently looking for my first printer. I really thought the K meant something. Thanks for opening my eyes!
I wanted to preface the below is coming from a fan of the channel, your opinions and I wanted to give you feed back cause I genuinely care…
F me, even as a content creator this was hard to watch the beginning get on with it man. Even watching it at 2x speed is unbearable my guy. I like your videos when I come across it but this was so hard to watch. like I didn't even care by the time you got to it. I stopped watching just so I can write this comment. I actually care to tell you this is not the way forward for growth. If you have an opinion share it. Look at MKBHD's videos, All his stuff is opinions but he doesn't go through all the cheesy ways to get engagement and trick the algorithm to keep people engaged. I genuinely like the perspective you bring to your videos. But cut out all the BS, this reminds me of being in college when you were told to write a 10 page essay and you only had 2 pages of info just to stretch it out. It really doesn't respect your audience and thats why I think you can get more growth if you stopped that. There should be some self promotion a reminder to follow but do it in a tasteful way. It's your channel you obviously run it as you like in the end. Maybe I been just too focused on short form content that watching long form like this just drives me crazy.
Thank you SO MUCH! Voxels all the way. Thank you so much for putting this video out there. You have said it so much better than I could have ever had. 👌🏼
Its simple, dont look at the screen resolution but look at the microns, pixel size, to get a sense of the print quality.
I think this makes sense for LCD mSLA. However, we need a metric that shows why DLP gets better prints at lower resolution. And that has to do with the coherence of the light itself.
I think you can combine all of these things into the volume of the frustum (like a pyramid with the top chopped off) between where the pixel is masked and the projection that actually makes it to the previous layer.
Since people like to buy larger numbers, we just flip it (ie 1/v). This gives a number in 1/um3 they can market.
I’m sure there’s a way for them to rig it, because I just thought of it now
8k is irrelevant. 12k is irrelevant. Because what we also want to know is the voxel dimension. But even the microns per voxel dimension is somewhat irrelevant, because the fidelity of those pixels can vary, as does the wattage per cubic micron.
For example, given the Saturn 3 Ultra has a new fresnel lens directing the light whereas the rest of the competition does not, it will produce far better detail and more accurate reproduction than anything in its class.
How do we define this in a standard?
Because for my money, that's pretty damn important. The fact that you called this out was central to my purchase of the S3U.
Until then, voxel size is a better proxy than the resolution of the filter screen.
It's a marketing gimick and anyone who can recognize those will see them everywhere even in their sleep. Brands need something to tout their product is the best so they have come up with this. If you want a specific measurement pull out your calculator and do the work. Big companies have a serious case of GNF that is, give no F@cks. Basically we know its a crappy measurement get over it.
Why not all dimensions of the voxel and just not the biggest?
Yes!! This!!!
Maybe maybe reupload the Video with a shorter Rant so more people get your point or swap the parts. So in the first half you say why it’s irrelevant and then why it shouldn’t be used to advertise
I fdm print now. Really enjoy the builds. I have been looking at resin and think this video answered questions I had about the machines. Thank you 👍 from me.
There needs to be a unifying measurement on how far you can zoom in to a print until pixelation/sharp edges for sure, as soon as geometrics are observed, as in equilateral shapes such as squares or hexagons? Until then it is always going to be drilling down in the specs' so to speak, to find how detailed or how nearer we are to the photonic scale? You could mimic photonic with lenses/lensing effects eventually with no real need to achieve that kind of resolution on an engineering level. No JK, I wonder if opticians and particle physicists would help here? An atom is constant is it not?…I mean, 3D printing is great!!!…Digest that generative text A.I.!!! 😉…You make an excellent point and until marketing wakes up I hope you continue to enlighten mate. Good on you…..I'll take a breath now……
How do you pretend exactly to change the marjeting from the industry? Mailing the companies? Socual media request? I agree with the AVC meassure, tahtbshould be the value related to quality printing, understanding lower AVC better quality prints but there are another factors to decide to buy a printer.
Got to say this was my first vid by you I watched and like the rest already pointed out once you got past the waffle waffle stage, and got to the point is when I got really interested as I been putting off getting a printer till I get my new home and move. Thank goodness I put it off as I'd been in line with the K equals better right? crowd.. Now better informed I'll do more digging on printers and keep my eye on the used car salesmanship (upselling a potentially huge pile of garbage as a diamond) of printer makers. So thanks for that going to watch some of your other vids now and subbed😁😁🙃😁😁